But how come the requirement to be sheeps are all related to
deeds done while goat for deeds undone? By that, are we trying to
say that good deeds can only come from christians and all other
faith never do anything good?
Perhaps you take a re-look at my earlier answer as I edited it
slightly mom ago. It just happen that it will also fit into your
second part on knowingly or unknowingly.
If deeds has nothing to do with salvation, why did Jesus send
only sheeps to heaven? Since deeds has nothing to do with
salvation, goat also can go what?
Isaiah 53:6 - For we all like sheep has gone astray
Psalms 23 - The Lord is my shepherd etc etc
plus tons of other verses linking followers of Jesus to be
sheep....
the context of the Matthew verse is about deeds that we do
UNKNOWINGLY.
.... however you can choose not to accept that explanation.
I did not avoid accepting those verses that says faith
alone. But I did mention what then is faith? And I point to
James who says faith without deeds is dead. Did Paul and James
contradict? I think that's what we need to look at.
For me, I think they complement each other. Both are teaching
and preaching what Jesus taught to his disciples. So, I went back
to the 4 Gospels and I am convinced by scriptures that salvation is
by faith but faith without deeds is dead (and this parable we are
talking about is a clear indication by Jesus to us). Therefore, I
find that salvation by faith and deeds makes more sense to me.
This of course is my personal choice and you do not need to
agree. But I think there are grounds for us to ponder right?
Sure I can ponder, but can you? Note: no one, dumb2 and myself
included are saying that we should NOT DO good works. We are saying
that good works and salvation do not necessary go hand in hand....
to go beyond the DIFFERENCE in DEFINITION of FAITH, I think that
there is a great divide over what we think SALVATION is.
What Jesus means by "Many" in Mat 7:22 is us... the believers
who know Him, who tell people about Him. It is us who believe in
His name. It cannot be the unbelievers, why would the unbelievers
do all those things in Jesus name, but yet Jesus called them
evildoers, why? Because only he who does the will
of my Father who is in Heaven will enter the Kingdom of Heaven.
And for Matt 5:29-30, unfortunatelly, Jesus means it literally.
I can back it up, but it is a Catholic thing, if you don't open
your mind, you won't believe it.
You assume that the "Many" in Matt 7:22 are believers? If they
are believers how can Jesus not know them? Haven't you heard of
cults, or people who incorporate Christianity into other
religions?
Matt 5:29-30? You Opus Dei?
"based on standard Bible-speak...." from where is your
source and who decides the standard? If you can convince me
that Jesus is teaching us (from scriputre) that only Christians
(Sheeps) can do good deeds and Non-Christians (Goats) cannot do
good deeds, I will retink......
If going to heaven is not salvation ?? then what is ??
How to rethink - based on hearsay??
Did I say that only Christians can do good deeds and
non-Christians cannot do good deeds? I am saying that in this
analogy, the FIRST differentiation is NOT really about the good
works, but the fact that the people were already divided in
Christians and non-Christians. People who are Christians already
found salvation and the result of that salvation is that they do
good works. Otherwise why use the imagery of sheep and goats....??
Why not white sheep and black sheep??
Salvation is, strictly speaking, NOT ABOUT GOING TO HEAVEN.
Going to heaven is a byproduct of salvation.
Salvation is, in simple English, accepting Jesus as your
personal saviour and in doing so, having one's life cleanse from
sin and allowing Christ to take over your life.
If you can prove that you are sinless and blameless 24/7, than
we can talk more about salvation with works.
